Iraqi TV Interviews Officials, Figures on Threat of War With Turkey

Al-Iraqiyah Television at 1925 gmt on 20 October carries a new episode of its “Hot Files” talk show moderated by Ahmad Mulla Tala. This episode deals with the Turkish-Iraqi crisis caused by Turkey’s insistence on pursuing the PKK into northern Iraq and the reactions of the Iraqi government and officials to this Turkish step. The announcer hosts Dr Ali al-Dabbagh, spokesman for the Iraqi government, from Washington; Orkhan Muhammad Ali, Turkish political analyst, from Turkey; and Mala Bakhtiar, member of the Political Bureau of the Patriotic Union of Kurdistan, from Al-Sulaymaniyah.

Tala asks Orkhan as to why Turkey has exacerbated the situation with Iraq against the backdrop of its fight against the PKK at this time. Orkhan expresses surprise at the statement by the announcer that it was Turkey that escalated the situation “adding a terrorist group has been infiltrating from northern Iraq to kill people and withdraw” adding that 25 Turkish soldiers and civilians were killed in just two weeks, wondering “Is this Turkey’s fault and has the escalation been from the Turkish side or from these terrorist groups?” Orkhan adds that all the weapons used by the PKK came from northern Iraq.

The announcer asks Orkhan why the Turkish Government does not approach the Iraqi Government to settle the issue peacefully instead of resorting to threats. Orkhan says that Turkey has held many contacts with the Iraqi Government over the years without attaining any results and has tried all possible venues and peaceful means to no avail.

Turning to Dr Ali al-Dabbagh in Washington, the announcer asks him to comment on Turkey’s threats to carry out cross border operations in northern Iraq and if all peaceful and diplomatic means have been exhausted. Dr Al-Dabbagh says: “Diplomatic or political solutions have not been exhausted. Brandishing the threat to use force is not the solution. We admit that there is a problem. There is a terrorist threat to our brothers in Turkey and to our dear neighbour in Turkey. This organization harms us in Iraq because it sabotages the relationship and causes problems. This is what we believe in. But to brandish the use of force is not the beginning of the solution. We must not begin by brandishing the use of force to solve the problem.” Al-Dabbagh adds that the major PKK forces are in Turkey but “these are border areas and as you said at the beginning of your report the Turkish forces crossed into northern Iraq 24 times with the approval of the Iraqi authorities under Saddam Husayn’s regime and failed to wipe out the PKK. Therefore, if it enters for the 25th time, there will be problems because the current situation in Iraq differs from what it was in the past. A series of problems will arise. I believe we must keep away from these problems. There are mechanisms such as the three-way committee that was formed. I believe it can seek the appropriate solutions and Iraq will abide by the results of these talks. A ranking delegation under the Iraqi defence minister is supposed to leave [destination not specified] over the next two days to discuss the mechanisms for solving this problem. We do not want this problem to become a time bomb that threatens our relations. I do not imagine that it is in Turkey’s interest to brandish the use of force against a neighbour that wishes to have good relations with it and we seek to check any threat against our brothers in Turkey.”

Asked how the Iraqi government defines the PKK, Al-Dabbagh says: “The official definition is that it is a terrorist organization that carries out terrorist operations that harm the Turkish people and us in Iraq. Neither the federal government nor the government in Kurdistan supports the PKK operations against the Turkish people and the Turkish forces and against any other country in the region. I believe that all parties and the government at all levels abide by this stand.”

Turning to Bakhtiar in Al-Sulaymaniyah, the announcer asks him to comment on this stand by the government on the PKK. Bakhtiar says: “The Kurdistan Region government does not officially criticize the central government’s permissive stand on the PKK but is not pleased with it because it fails to adopt an explicit stand on the Turkish actions on the borders and Turkey’s cross border operations into Iraq. This is the first point. The second point is that we would like to further clarify our stand” on the Turkish accusations made by Orkhan Muhammad Ali who accuses the Kurdistan Government of implicitly supporting the PKK which carries out operations from Iraqi territories, says “The PKK’s deployment along the border strip from the Qandil area to the area that is adjacent to the Turkish borders is not the outcome of an official agreement with the government of the Kurdistan region or the approval of the Democratic Party of Kurdistan under Mas’ud Barzani or that of the Patriotic Union of Kurdistan under Jalal Talabani. The PKK came and imposed itself on these areas and we are experiencing with them many military, political, administrative, media, and ideological problems. Everyone knows about this.” Bakhtiar adds that the PKK was established in Turkey and was supported by certain countries in the region and not by the Kurdistan region and “imposed itself as an armed movement on the borders, a move that we do not support.”

Turning once again to Ali al-Dabbagh, the announcer asks him to comment on reports that the central government by adopting a weak position on the Turkish threats wants to punish the Kurdistan Government for trying to act as an independent government, Al- Dabbagh says: “This is not the stand of the Iraqi Government” adding that “Iraq is a federal country and the government is a federal government. There are constants to be respected. First of all, Iraq will not act as a policeman for Turkey to implement what some want. The second point is that the Iraqi Government will not accept to have the Kurdistan Region act on a sovereign issue that has to do with the federal government and no one contests this because it is a constitutional issue. The brothers in Kurdistan know this.” Al- Dabbagh adds: “The government does not wish the Kurdistan Region to be attacked or threatened. The Kurdistan Region is part of Iraq and it is a stable area. Therefore, what harms Kurdistan harms Iraq. We have a gateway to Europe that passes through Kurdistan and this is very important because we currently experience an economic situation that arises as a result of this threat and leads at times to the closure of the Iraqi borders.” Al-Dabbagh adds that Turkey has the right to ask Iraq and the US forces in Iraq to safeguard the borders to prevent PKK operations, says “this is a legitimate right and I believe that Iraq is ready to take any measures through a bilateral agreement and not through brandishing the threat to use force. Turkey cannot impose solutions and say: either you do this or I enter Iraq. I do not believe that this is part of the international legitimacy that can act as a judge. Iraq is ready to discuss any topic that might lead to stabilization on the borders with Turkey” and any action against the PKK “should be made through a bilateral agreement and not through unilateral measures.” Al-Dabbagh adds that the Kurdistan region is a mountainous area and neither the Kurdistan government, the government in Baghdad nor the US forces can reach these areas, adding “there are other solutions that I do not want to discuss here. Had I not been the official spokesman I would have discussed them. Turkey must take these solutions into consideration in addition to the solution of the use of force. But this is not our concern and we do not interfere in it because it is Turkish domestic affair. Such a problem cannot be solved by armed conflicts because the region suffered a lot from armed conflicts and armed conflicts will never settle a chronic problem as that posed by the PKK and the Kurdish problem.” Al-Dabbagh adds: “As Iraqi Government, we believe that bilateral agreements and the formation of bilateral committees are the solution and not the threat to use force.”

As for Bakhtiar, he explains how the Kurds have been trying over the years to solve the issue of the PKK and prevent its members from carrying out their operations from across the Iraqi borders and the Kurds have at various times reached agreements with the PKK to halt its operations against Turkey. Bakhtiar adds: “From a military point of view, it goes without saying that the Kurdistan Region does not have the military means to act and settle the issue decisively as Turkey or any other party wants us to do. We officially do not accept the presence of the PKK in our border areas” adding that since Turkey cannot control the PKK elements on its territory, how can the Kurds who are not as strong militarily as the Turks settle the issue militarily. Bakhtiar adds: “The issue is a political issue and should be settled politically and the appropriate solution should be found politically. This is the soundest course that is backed by the United Nations and all the countries in the world.”

The announcer asks Al-Dabbagh to explain why the Iraqi Government managed to deal firmly with the Mojahedin-e Khalq organization while it has failed to do so with the PKK. Al-Dabbagh says: “No, it is not fair to say this and I do not want to act as a defence lawyer but the Mojahedin-e Khalq was in an area that can be reached. Therefore, one can control it. In spite of this, we have some remarks even on this control. The Mojahedin-e Khalq is not as controlled as the Iraqi Government wants for reasons known to all. The PKK is different for it is in remote and rugged terrain and in areas which are difficult to reach” adding that Saddam with his military machine and the many years he fought the Kurds, was not able to defeat them. Al-Dabbagh adds: “I do not believe the issue is that we give preference to this or that or adopt a permissive stand. It is an issue of a reality on the ground that we must deal with and not an issue of wishes.”

Originally published by Al-Iraqiyah TV, Baghdad, in Arabic 1925 20 Oct 07.

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